Part 2 in our two part episode centers around Patty’s latest book, Becoming Kin. I begin with the question about the way forward: what does a decolonized and liberating community look like? Patty responds by sharing a story she recounts in her book about the deer. The relationships we have with the land can help inform and change the ways we organize our society. We examine how the racialized church creates barriers to belonging, and how some traditions must pause to interrogate how we form community and relationships. That includes the church as a whole wrestling with their central calling–is it mission? If so, is that inherently colonial?

We then switch gears to ask whether or not church institutions today can change. What would the institutional church re-orient towards if it was serious about ushering in change. Or is it more inclined towards self-preservation? Patty then introduces the “trickster” figure in various traditions, and how they operate as prophets who provoke change. Where are the tricksters today?

If the kingdom of God is among us, if it is here, shouldn’t the [institution] be looking for it rather than imposing it? Shouldn’t they be wondering, “what has God been doing here before we came?” But they never asked those questions, it was just about imposing their version of the kingdom on us. So if [this] institution fails, that’s OK.

We close off about the talk of inclusion. Inclusion into what? Why would BIPOC folks want chairs at tables established by the western church? So what does a new thing look like? We spend the last third of our conversation adding language and features into the new thing. We can start by looking at the communities that we like….listen for more beautiful stories including a re-telling of the ‘Good’ Samaritan.

About Patty Krawec: Through writing and podcasting Patty Krawec (Anishinaabe/Ukranian) explores how we might live differently in the relationships we inherit. She is a co-founder of the Nii’kinaaganaa Foundation and her book, Becoming Kin: An Indigenous Call to Unforgetting the Past and Reimagining Our Future was published in September by Broadleaf Books. Krawec lives on Twitter as @gindaanis. Find her online at htttp://



Faith in a Fresh Vibe
Faith in a Fresh Vibe
#57 - Can the Church Decolonize? Rohadi and Patty Krawec (Part 2)